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Wade
Dodge Dakota
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2/25/2003
00:16:31
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 Subject: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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I have been trying to decide whether to get my Dakota CC 4x2 in an Auto or 5-speed. I have heard that the 5-speed has about 10 more rwhp than the auto. Is that true? And is the 5-speed alot faster than the auto overall? I plan on doing alot of mods to mine, just wanted to see which one would be better for street racing. I was also wondering if the 5-speeds were more durable than the auto's. I could really use some helpful information in making this decision. Thanks
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tweaked
Dodge Dakota
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2/25/2003
00:27:45
|  RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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i have a 97 5.2 manual with 3.92s and let me tell you what, if you want all out speed then definitly get the manual, my dad has a 4.7 qc auto, and i enjoy driving that much more than my manual, but my manual is faster, but he doesnt have 3.92s, i personally think the 3.92s are too close for a manual, because you shift really quick, not a bad thing just annoying when you drive 50 or more miles a day, in my opinion i would get the auto, but if you plan on going nuts the manual will hold up to more power, hope this helps
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Wade
Dodge Dakota
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2/25/2003
01:09:19
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Yes, it helps alot tweaked. Thank you
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b1llyw
DakotaEnthusiast
2/25/2003
09:02:08
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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5 speed, 5 speed, 5 speed. The 4.7 is a revvy motor and loves the 5 speed. I made 196hp/272tq at the rear on my 4.7, 5 speed, 4x4. That's as much or more than some guys make with a 4.7/auto/2wd.
As for gears, I also have 3.92's. It does make a 1st gear a little steep but I love it after that. It puts you right in your power band all the time.
Bill White
2002 QC 4x4, SLT , 4.7, 5 spd, 3.92 LSD
1995 CC 4x2, SLT, 318, 5 spd, 3.55 LSD
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Texas Todd
Dodge Dakota
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2/25/2003
09:34:21
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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I have the 4.7, 5psd manual, Qc, LSD, etc. etc.
I've always liked the manuals, thats why I got one!-ordered my truck with it!
But, you asked about durability.
I had a 3rd gear synchro go out, under warranty. Unles you shifted easy, low r's, it would grind. They replaced the whole tranny.
I haven't upgraded to a hurst shifter-yet. Those that have say it's an improvement.
Overall, I think the NV 3500 is a good tranny. There's people (duner, etc.) with blowers on their's and haven't had a problem yet.
I do know, I read all the time about the problems with the autos-I always get a kick out of it actually.
Funny thing, in a sailing accident in May of 2002, I destroyed my LEFT knee, triple ligament damage. I drove my truck 2 days after the accident, and drove it after the reconstructive surgery also. Unless you're an idiot, you really don't shift that much with a manual. I live in Houston, TX,-big, congested city-traffic-NO problem.
To summarize:
5spd
-more HP/tq to the rear the wheels
-stay in power bands better, shifts when YOU want
-more durable, less problems overall
auto
-shifts when IT wants
-less power to the wheels
-many documented problems
-?
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Texas Todd
Dodge Dakota
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2/25/2003
09:54:36
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Wade, just this morning reading about problems with the 4.7, auto, and rpm fluctuations, etc.
Bottom line, nothings perfect.
Make a decision you'll STAY happy with!
From what you described in your orig. post, Manual tranny all the way!
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Chris
Dodge Dakota
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2/25/2003
10:55:57
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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I say go manual. On my 2000 with the 4.7 5-speed and 3.92's I can stay in 4th down to about 15 MPH at about 500RPM and then pull with traffic up to 100+ mph without shifting... Get the 5-speed you will love it with this engine!!!
Just ordered me a new CC with a 4.7 5-speed on Saturday... Can't wait...
Chris
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AL
Dodge Dakota
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2/25/2003
11:03:58
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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i have 4.7 5speed and 355 gears. I just wanted to say that i cant imagine putting smallers gears in this truck. I already shift as fast as I can and still seems i'm a bit slow. First gear is so small that if you were to put smaller gears in, it would make 1st a PITA to use.
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Notchlx
Dodge Dakota
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2/25/2003
14:55:25
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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The 4.7 5-spd is a good combo.
Arguably faster than the R/T's. As somebody said before, these are rev monsters. The higher in the rpm band you keep them, the better they respond.
The 3:92's in this truck sometimes do seem a bit too much. However, I just take off in 2nd gear or 3rd gear. If you plan on modding the truck I would recommend the 3:92L/S rear.
I have a 2000 SLT regular cab 5-spd with 21,000 miles on the clock. I recently added a Paxton blower. The stock unit is holding up fine for now, including the stock clutch. We'll see how much longer it lasts. The tranny doesn't show any signs of weakness yet though.
http://www.hemicota.stangnet.com
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tweaked
Dodge Dakota
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2/25/2003
15:06:02
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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hey all just out of curiosity what does your truck shift out of 1st at redline at, what mph, just wonder, thanx
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sandman
Dodge Dakota
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2/25/2003
19:44:28
|  RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Well a reg cab 4.7 manual is almost as fast out of the box as an R/T. So yes if performance is your thing then get the manual. If street performance or off raoding were my main goal then an manual is the best way to go. I did not have that choice with my QC and I am sure the wife liked it that way!! She drives it the most and she was getting tired of my manual fetish!!
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Teamfast
Dodge Dakota
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2/25/2003
21:38:29
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Message:
I agree AL, ive got 355s and first gear aint bad, but im
looking fr more pull. I considered 392s and even 410s
but i think thats too high. It is a slow shifting
transmission, even with synthetic its SLOW!!!!
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tweaked
Dodge Dakota
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2/25/2003
23:01:58
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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hey team what does your truck shift out of first at, thanx
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modain
Dodge Dakota
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2/26/2003
00:26:57
|  RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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My $0.02
I am *so* glad I got my 4.7L QC with a 5-speed stick. First off I really like running through the gears. Second, it's all about who's in charge? Third, the power. Fourth, I better get on with it...
While over the course of two years looking, but not seriously, every salesperson (so called) basically asked me the same question: "Why would you want a stick? You'd rather have an automatic in stop-n-go traffic.". (I live in Los Angeles - lots of cars and traffic.) I was quite amused at how they knew better than I did at what suited me best.
Anyway, when I got serious about making my purchase I found a salesman that wanted to sell me what I wanted to buy. He found two in just under three hours. I bought my truck (basically sight unseen) two days later.
I agree with an have experienced all the gushing virtues you've read earlier.
Outside of the slow shifting (between 2-3 especially) there is nothing I am not happy with about my tranny.
According to my calculations (I've only gone to about 5000) here is the speed you can take it to in first gear at a given RPM provided you have a 4.01 1st and 3.92 rear.
1000 1500 2000 2500 3000 3500
5.5 8.3 11.0 13.8 16.5 19.3 4000 4500 5000 5500 6000 6500
22.0 24.8 27.5 30.3 33.0 35.8
----------------------
2002 QC SLT Plus, 4.7L 5-speed, 3.92 LSD
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modain
Dodge Dakota
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2/26/2003
00:44:47
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Sorry, the "chart" alignment got trashed. So here is another way.
1000 - 5.5
1500 - 8.3
2000 - 11.0
2500 - 13.8
3000 - 16.5
3500 - 19.3
4000 - 22.0
4500 - 24.8
5000 - 27.5
5500 - 30.3
6000 - 33.0
6500 - 35.8
----------------------
2002 QC SLT Plus, 4.7L 5-speed, 3.92 LSD
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RaZoR
Dodge Dakota
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2/26/2003
12:52:09
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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I got the auto 4.7 and find I'm actually quicker than the 5 speeds (I'm gunna hear about this one!). Like other people have said i tried out both before i bought and found the ratios too low int the 5spd. I was a die hard standard fan but found that with this truck, the auto made more sense. With the average driver in a 5 speed i can HOOK up faster and i'm usually a truck or so ahead before they stop squaking their tires, but i am sure there are plenty of "above average" 5 speed guys on the board. (avoiden some slack hehehe)
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Demon Dakota
DakotaEnthusiast
2/26/2003
16:08:54
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Message:
Considering that I ran a 14.68 in a dead stock 5 speed RC 4.7L Dak (3.55 LSD), I'd say that the 5 speed is definitely the better performer "when driven properly". There are autos out there like ME ;) that can FINALLY hit mid to upper 14's with consistancy, but it took a lot of work to get there. Well, I have a CC too (not a RC). If the mods from my truck were on a RC Dak 5 speed, he'd be in the low 14's with ease. If he had the 3.92's and slicks, he maybe would be 14 flat or 13.9x's (able to hang with stock Mustang GT's). That's great considering the initial cost of the vehicle, and the overall weight of the vehicle, along with the fact that those mods might cost you $1200 including install labor. We have a real good platform for mods, in my opinion. We just need more mods...
K&N Drop in AF (CAI during summer months)
True Dual exhaust and removed third cat
HO Cams & HO Intake
FASTMAN 70mm TB
Autolite 3923 Plugs
TPS @ .76 VDC
IAT Adjuster Mod
14.52@94.2 MPH at Silver Dollar Raceway
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teamfast
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
2/26/2003
16:09:52
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Message:
Tweaked, Ive got a 5 spd, sorry i didnt say that.
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jaggy
GenIII
2/26/2003
17:19:43
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Message:
QC 4x4 manual here. (3.55 soon to be 3.92)
I like the auto in this truck, almost went with one. With the PCM mods you can adjust the shift points for more performance.
I still want full controle and when I'm in the dirt spinning all 4 tires around a corner I want to be able to control the skid with throddle and not have to worry about it shifting to another gear unexpectadly.
my $.02
Side note, I want to supercharge this bad boy and am wondering if I should keep the 3.55's or still drop to the 3.92's.
Notchlx, your opinion?
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Demon Dakota
DakotaEnthusiast
2/26/2003
17:51:56
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Message:
I'd keep the 3.55's personally, but that's just me.
K&N Drop in AF (CAI during summer months)
True Dual exhaust and removed third cat
HO Cams & HO Intake
FASTMAN 70mm TB
Autolite 3923 Plugs
TPS @ .76 VDC
IAT Adjuster Mod
14.52@94.2 MPH at Silver Dollar Raceway
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TheSync
Dodge Dakota
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2/26/2003
18:54:26
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Message:
Is the 3:55 a posi, or is it just a regular rear end? Is LSD a posi? Thinking about doing performance, just not sure which rear end is better for street racing if i added mods to it (it would be an auto).
Demon Dakota, when you hit your mid 14's, do you shift your auto, or just stay in one gear?
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notchlx
Dodge Dakota
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2/26/2003
21:07:30
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Jaggy,
I wish I could give you an answer. I myself, would like to try a 3:55 rearend. I believe with a centrifugal charger like the Paxton, the 3:92's are better suited. On a Kenne Bell charged truck, it may be a little different. The 3:55's may be more of a racer friendly gear.
I'm torn..I'd like a quick-change rear. I would also like to run some 4:56 gears at the track. The 3:92's still have some rpm left in 4th as it traps.
If you stay with the 3:55's, get a posi unit or the L/S. YOU'LL NEED IT. ;)
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Demon Dakota
DakotaEnthusiast
2/26/2003
21:19:35
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
IP: Logged
Message:
LSD is the same thing as posi...they are just named different due to the companies that made them. Chevy/GMC call is Positraction, Ford calls is Posi Lok, Dodge LSD or Posi Trak...but it's all the same thing in reality. The lockers themselves are manufactured differently and have different ways that they work.
K&N Drop in AF (CAI during summer months)
True Dual exhaust and removed third cat
HO Cams & HO Intake
FASTMAN 70mm TB
Autolite 3923 Plugs
TPS @ .76 VDC
IAT Adjuster Mod
14.52@94.2 MPH at Silver Dollar Raceway
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Demon Dakota
DakotaEnthusiast
2/26/2003
21:30:06
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Message:
The limited slip differential can be had with the 3.55 or the 3.92's. I'd still stick with the 3.55 with the KB blower due to it's almost instant on boost. 3.92's will have a more difficult time hooking up. If you have a turbo setup or another style blower that doesn't kick in until higer RPM, then go with the 3.92's to help you get off the line a bit better.
And yes, I absolutely shifted my auto manually when I ran the 14.52 (approx 5000 RPM shift points). I'm hoping the HO Intake moved the power band up a bit so I can use the top end more from now on. I need to use this track season to practice some new techniques. I so need the KB Optimizer II right now...and the 4.7L FAST system...and a nice little 50 shot of N2O...ok...enough babbling.
K&N Drop in AF (CAI during summer months)
True Dual exhaust and removed third cat
HO Cams & HO Intake
FASTMAN 70mm TB
Autolite 3923 Plugs
TPS @ .76 VDC
IAT Adjuster Mod
14.52@94.2 MPH at Silver Dollar Raceway
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KJW
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
2/26/2003
21:30:25
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Message:
Modain....a comment:
I live in Ventura county and when I bought my 01 QC 4x4 I got the same thing. "why do you want a stick"
Hey you know what????
I want a stick because that's what I want and just because you don't have one on the lot don't try to sell me something else!!!
With that I went out to Lancaster and the guy located me a dark green 4x4 QC 5spd. in San Luis Obispo and did a dealer trade for it that night.
All these guys want to do is sell you what they have on the lot.
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modain
Dodge Dakota
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2/27/2003
02:25:13
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Message:
KJW,
What's that old saying? "The customer's always right"?
Unfortunately too many so-called "sales people" that I encountered don't sell for the right reason. Did they really think I want to plop down a large chunk of cash (or go deep into debt) to buy something I didn't want? Go figure!
The silver lining is you and I found someone who listened and made the sale happen.
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KJW
Dodge Dakota
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2/27/2003
12:31:15
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Message:
Modain:
Well the reason your post hit me is that a friend of mine that I do business with in Allentown Pa. is buying a Dakota right now. He was telling me the other day that they told him he could not get the color he wanted and he could not get the stick etc. etc.
I told him not to listen to them.....
Let them know that you are going to buy the truck now but can wait a couple of days for them to locate it. Tell them what you want and if they won't find it some other dealership will.
He picked it up last night!!
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Texas Todd
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
2/27/2003
12:39:28
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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I had to order my QC dak, they way I wanted it!
Sooo glad I did too. Imagine that, I ordered the color(s)-two tone, the way I wanted it!
01 QC 4.7 5spd lsd etc. etc.
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b1llyw
DakotaEnthusiast
2/27/2003
12:41:57
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Message:
I had to order my '02 also. They could not find another truck with the option/combo that I wanted.
Bill White
2002 QC 4x4, SLT , 4.7, 5 spd, 3.92 LSD
1995 CC 4x2, SLT, 318, 5 spd, 3.55 LSD
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Steve
Dodge Dakota
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2/27/2003
21:25:40
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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i stumbled across what i wanted on a lot. and on sale. i couldn't believe it. the dealer told me that most people dont like the combination of rc, 287, 5 speed, 3.92 LSD. i'm glad they dont, otherwise i might not have gotten it.
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01Motorsport
Dodge Dakota
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3/01/2003
01:08:33
| RE: 4.7 Auto or 5 speed?
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Message:
Same combo as you, Steve...I test drove a '03 R/T a few weeks ago out of curiosity. After 10 miles the slushbox was driving me nuts! It's funny how the manual becomes "automatic" if you drive a lot (28K/year for me).
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