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V6 Dakotas
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Matthew
Dodge Dakota
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6/06/2010
14:34:38
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 Subject: Throttle Body Issue
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Hello all,
I'd like to first start out by saying, I am not a car guy. I work on computers and networks for a living, but I am mechanically inclined.
I recently bought a used 97 Dakota from a friend of mine, higher mileage, nearing 200k right now. I didn't pay too much for it, $1200. I figured it was a great buy as everything was in great working condition. Transmission glides, chassis in good condition, but before I bought it he warned me of an issue it has.
He told me it has an issue with the throttle body. Now I've done some research on it, as I wasn't aware of what a TB was before he mentioned it. (Yes I was that oblivious)
So heres the issue:
Normal day:
I go out to start it, sometimes it fires when turning the ignition, sometimes I have to give it gas to make it fire (like back in the old days) Nothing really too annoying, I just assumed/understood(please correct me if I'm wrong) it was just opening the butterfly valve, letting more air in, which in return causes combustion, (correct?)
Well after I've done this, and the truck has fired, (I never had an issue with it not firing when doing this, or a normal start) I'll toss it in reverse, pull out of the driveway.
Next I'll toss it into 2nd (yes I avoid drive initially) the reason for this is because the truck will not get past 2kRPM even when flooring it, when I'm under 30ish. Soon as I'm over 30, the truck kicks into 2nd/3third and drives fine, otherwise if I leave it in drive from 0-30ish, it has very little power.. Compared to my former v6 at least. But like I say, soon as I hit a point, the engine acts fine. I do drop it back into drive soon as its all set.I can engage/disengage the overdrive, this dosnt seem to help, so its always on.
so, right now I've gotten the car on the road, and am starting to drive, well here's what happens, the engine (when cold, cold can be 10 mnins or 10 hours) will drive, but then it will try and 'stall' it doesn't actually stall, but if I don't release the gas and then press it again, the engine will stay at the rpm it was at, and climb extremely slowly, but as soon as I release, give it gas again, it 'resets' it, and the truck moves fine. I have to repeat this maybe 2-3 times before the truck runs great. Normally I'm not out of my development when this is happening, in other words, within 3 mins of starting the truck and driving, it runs fine, after i take care of the issue with it 'stalling'
Alright, so I've adapted to this, and its been fine. (the guy I bought it from said he did the same thing everyday, it was a dodge defect.)
so, recently, last 2 days, I've had a different issue. I'll start it (normal or with a bit of gas as described above) but I don't have ,the issue with the TB immediately, the truck doesn't try and stall. Its odd, In fact I was so used to driven like I did, it struck me as a shock when I didn't have to rev it.
SO, I start driving, and I have the TB issue maybe 4 miles down the road, but after I do my normal process, it continues to happen, I notice that the tachometer drops 100-200 RPM when the truck starts to 'stall' I'll release the gas, and it'll go, but instead of it picking up speed/rpm I may have to release the gas peddle, and then press it multiple times, after maybe 5 depresses/releases, I'll have hit 30+ truck is over 2KRPM and it drives fine.
but what bothers me is that if I get stuck at stop lights, I could be sitting there trying to get the darn thing to go.
It helps that the truck has dual flowmasters on the back so its really easy to hear the engine 'drop', it also corroborates the whole thing, in other words, truck doesn't want to go, muffler sounds different and the rpm drops.
The new issue is the rpm dropping and the TB issue acting up after the truck warms up.
I'd like to take this time to apologize for the wall of text, I felt it was necessary to explain in the best detail I can, because the mechanics I've talked to, look at me like I'm crazy.
I'm looking for any information that yall can give me. I don't know how expensive the fix will be, but I'm on a limited budget, and am seriously considering trying to sell the truck if it looks to be an expensive fix.
Important information:
New fuel pump/filter, Under 300 miles. I got some really bad gas a cosco, and it ruined the pump.. This gas was so bad it has bits of pine needles and small rocks in it.
Stock 97 dakota, 3.9L v6, nothing special. No Cruise control, completely stock
I've read a few posts, and somewhere someone mentioned an issue that sounded similar to mine, I think the solution was the TB sensor. Now I don't know where this is, but if its a simple enough fix, and sounds like the issue I'm describing I'd like to know some more information.
Thanks for reading and I look forward to any assistance yall can provide!
Matthew
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Matthew
Dodge Dakota
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6/06/2010
14:39:53
| RE: Throttle Body Issue
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Message:
Update:
More information:
3.9L Magnum
The Check engine light is stuck on. I cannot run a diagnostic, the plug on the dash dosn't work, according to autozone.
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try
Dodge Dakota
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6/06/2010
15:06:04
| RE: Throttle Body Issue
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Message:
Have you tried the key on, key off method?
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try
Dodge Dakota
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6/06/2010
15:09:10
| RE: Throttle Body Issue
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Message:
Have you tried the key on, key off method?
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daddio
Dodge Dakota
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6/06/2010
15:37:27
| RE: Throttle Body Issue
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Yes, use the key method to retrieve codes. Turn the key on/ off/ on off/ on and the codes whould display in teh odometer. By "on" I mean not "start". the codes hould display as PXXXX then Pdone when it's finshed or there are no codes to display.
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try
Dodge Dakota
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6/06/2010
15:55:46
| RE: Throttle Body Issue
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Message:
No idea why that double posted, t wasn't on purpose.
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Matthew
Dodge Dakota
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6/06/2010
16:25:27
| RE: Throttle Body Issue
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I've tried the key on/ key off method and they codes do not display.
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try
Dodge Dakota
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6/06/2010
17:37:16
| RE: Throttle Body Issue
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You're not doing it properly or the pcm is toast.
I'd learn toward the first rather then the pcm.
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daddio
Dodge Dakota
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6/06/2010
17:41:02
| RE: Throttle Body Issue
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Try resetting the PCM. Disconnect teh positive battery terminal and turn the key to start and hold it there for about 30 seconds. Then reconnect it.
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Bob Lincoln
Dodge Dakota
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6/07/2010
08:39:52
| RE: Throttle Body Issue
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http://www.allpar.com/fix/codes/index.html
You have to turn the ignition ON, OFF, ON, OFF, then leave it ON the third time, all within about 5 seconds. If you do it very slowly, it will not initiate the code reading.
The first problem could be a bad TPS (throttle position sensor). It does not always trip a code. The power issue could be a broken, stuck or misadjusted Throttle Vavle cable. This replaces the old rigid downshift rod, and is mounted on the passenger side of the throttle body, runs down to the transmission. There should be about 1/8" slack in it with throttle closed, before it starts to move when you open the throttle. At the other end it connects to the tranny and pulls a lever. Make sure all that happens, and that the lever is not stuck. It can affect shift points and power. The codes might reveal more.
The bad gas probably clogged your fuel injectors and filter. I think the filter may be at the pump inside the tank on your vintage. The injectors should be cleaned. I always buy only brand-name gas for this reason.
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Matthew
Dodge Dakota
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6/07/2010
09:09:55
| RE: Throttle Body Issue
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Message:
@ Bob Lincoln.
Thanks for the great tips:
The error code I get is, 12, so, battery. Thats all I'm getting right now.
As for the fuelpump, Yea, the filter was clogged, but it was in such bad shape, it was just better replacing the whole unit.
After some research yesterday, I did go out and buy a TPS, went to put it on, but I couldnt get the old one off. I'm going to make some phonecall's and see if I can't get my hands on a a air wrench, I'll keep yall updated, but any other suggestions is appreciated.
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ftheabus
Dodge Dakota
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6/07/2010
09:59:19
| RE: Throttle Body Issue
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An air wrench to take off the TPS sensor? Try some 3 in 1 oil or any penetrating lubricant first.
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Matthew
Dodge Dakota
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6/07/2010
13:19:15
| RE: Throttle Body Issue
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@ FTHEABUS.
I had already tried that, didnt work, but I was able to get it off in the end.
I just replaced the TPS about an hour ago, and even after resetting the computer by disconnecting the battery, it didn't make a difference, I'm having the same issue with the new TPS on there.
Any other thoughts not that that's been replaced?
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ftheabus
Dodge Dakota
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6/07/2010
15:17:02
| RE: Throttle Body Issue
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How old is the battery? Last month I replaced mine after 9 years (not recommended to leave that long)and it runs a lot better.
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