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daver36
Dodge Dakota
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4/21/2008
19:35:53
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 Subject: Torque Management
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My truck has the electronic torque management from the factory. Worst dodge options ever. I was out goofing around in a muddy field and almost got stuck twice b/c the torque management kept forcing the rpm's down so I lost wheel speed. It definately wasn't lack of power b/c i was in 4x4 Lo and I even locked it down into 1st gear (automatic) and it still did it. Does anyone know if there's an individual fuse that this runs off of that I can pull out? The truck's a 2001 4.7 QC 4x4.
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greendak01
Dodge Dakota
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4/21/2008
20:37:50
| RE: Torque Management
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i dont know of a fuse or anything like that, but i do know you can get your transmission computer flashed and that permanently disables it, i have it done and i have never had anything like that happen, just be careful not to spin tires to fast when off roading.....something will break....trust me.
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daddio
Dodge Dakota
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4/21/2008
21:00:34
| RE: Torque Management
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i have read on the '00's there is a wire to cut and it will disable the TM. i'll try to dig it up.
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sam
Dodge Dakota
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4/25/2008
00:49:17
| RE: Torque Management
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The wire you are looking for is in the c3 connector of the pcm which is gray. You will have to unplug the connector to see the color. Pin 13 is the torque management request wire it is Yellow with a dark green stripe. If you cut this wire make sure and do it in an area that will allow you to re-solder it if you want to go back (at least a couple inches from the connector). Cutting this wire will result in harder shifts and possibly transmission failure if it is abused. This feature is used to reduce trans wear. The trans will shift normally but under hard accel it will shift hard so if you are pounding on it some problems may occur. The 45RFE trans is a very solid unit and will take a lot of abuse but durability will suffer with this wire disconnected.
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Kowalski
GenIII
4/25/2008
15:48:03
|  RE: Torque Management
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Are two different types of torque management being discussed here ? The type of torque management Sam, and I think maybe also daddio, are discussing here is simply a slight retard to timing as the truck shifts. I thought Daver36 was taliking about a different type of torque management like some cars have, since he called it an option. The type of torque management Sam is talking about is on all 4.7 automatics, and doesn't cause the symptoms Daver36 claimed in his origianal post; at least definitely not on my truck. Mine will keep wheel speed up pretty well shifting in the slippery stuff, I run into that plowing. I never did that mod, and have had the truck since new. All it does is cut back slightly on power when shifting. Doesn't prevent roosting through the slippery stuff when you want to.
Lead, follow, or get out of the way
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daver36
Dodge Dakota
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4/26/2008
19:14:03
| RE: Torque Management
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I'm not sure what causes it. I know going through my "VIP summary report" I got from dodge that my truck came with the "Lock-Up Torque Converter", but I don't know if that means anything. The perfect example example of my "torque management would be in the rain (heavy rain). I can punch it at an intersection and she'll break loose and spin all the way through 1st, shift, spin through 2nd, shift, spin through 3rd, shift, the spin in 4th reaching about 5000 rpm when the torque management finally kicks in and forces the revs down to 3000 (where if it's really wet it will keep spinning, torquey little buggers the 4.7's are). The code for the lock-up torque converter is "DHAP", if anyone knows what that is.
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Kowalski
GenIII
4/27/2008
07:24:31
| RE: Torque Management
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Message:
They all have lock up torque converters; and have for many years. I'm not aware of any automatic truck on the market that doesn't have a lock up torque converter. So you aren't really talking about a torque management option that was ordered with you truck ? I've seen that on some cars, to control individual wheel speeds in slippery use; but haven't heard of it as a Dakota option. You could keep wheel speed higher using high range instead of low.
Lead, follow, or get out of the way
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Josh
Dodge Dakota
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4/27/2008
11:08:37
| RE: Torque Management
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"the spin in 4th reaching about 5000 rpm when the torque management finally kicks in and forces the revs down to 3000"
What you're feeling is not "torque management"; it's the torque converter locking up. This is normal 45RFE/545RFE automatic transmission activity.
When the torque converter locks, it's the equivalent of a fully engaged manual clutch - there is no longer a fluid coupling between the enging and transmission, it's a solid mechanical one.
What you see as the RPMs drop from 5K to 3K is the torque converter fluid coupling being replaced with the torque converter mechanical coupling. It's all done smoothly (electronically) in stages.
Here's some wording from my FSM on the torque converter
AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION -545RFE
DESCRIPTION
The 545RFE automatic transmission is a sophisticated, multi-range, electronically controlled transmission which combines optimized gear ratios for responsive performance, state of the art efficiency features and low NVH. Other features include driver adaptive shifting and three planetary gear sets to provide wide ratio capability with precise ratio steps for optimum driveability. The three planetary gear sets also make available a unique alternate second gear ratio. The primary 2nd gear ratio fits between 1st and 3rd gears for normal through-gear accelerations. The alternate second gear ratio (2prime) allows smoother 4-2 kickdowns at high speeds to provide 2nd gear passing performance over a wider highway cruising range. An additional overdrive ratio (0.67:1) is also provided for greater fuel economy and less NVH at highway speeds.
The hydraulic portion of the transmission consists of the transmission fluid, fluid passages, hydraulic valves, and various line pressure control components.
The primary mechanical components of the transmission consist of the following:
- Three multiple disc input clutches
- Three multiple disc holding clutches
- Five hydraulic accumulators
- Three planetary gear sets
- Dual Stage Hydraulic oil pump
- Valve body
- Solenoid pack
The TCM is the “heart” or “brain” of the electronic control system and relies on information from various direct and indirect inputs (sensors, switches, etc.) to determine driver demand and vehicle operating conditions. With this information, the TCM can calculate and perform timely and quality shifts through various output or control devices (solenoid pack, transmission control relay, etc.).
TORQUE CONVERTER
DESCRIPTION
The torque converter is a hydraulic device that couples the engine crankshaft to the transmission. The torque converter consists of an outer shell with an internal turbine, a stator, an overrunning clutch, an impeller and an electronically applied converter clutch. The converter clutch provides reduced engine speed and greater fuel economy when engaged. Clutch engagement also provides reduced transmission fluid temperatures.
TORQUE CONVERTER CLUTCH (TCC)
The TCC was installed to improve the efficiency of the torque converter that is lost to the slippage of the fluid coupling. Although the fluid coupling provides smooth, shock-free power transfer, it is natural for all fluid couplings to slip. If the impeller and turbine were mechanically locked together, a zero slippage condition could be obtained. A hydraulic piston with friction material was added to the turbine assembly to provide this mechanical lock-up. In order to reduce heat build-up in the transmission and buffer the powertrain against torsional vibrations, the TCM can duty cycle the L/R-CC Solenoid to achieve a smooth application of the torque converter clutch. This function, referred to as Electronically Modulated Converter Clutch (EMCC) can occur at various times depending on the following variables:
- Shift lever position
- Current gear range
- Transmission fluid temperature
- Engine coolant temperature
- Input speed
- Throttle angle
- Engine speed
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daver36
Dodge Dakota
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4/27/2008
16:03:34
| RE: Torque Management
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Good to know. Thanx for all the info guys, it's really been helpfull.
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onearmsteve
Dodge Dakota
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5/17/2008
21:51:05
| RE: Torque Management
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i have a 00 qc 4x4 HO cams and bbk 70mm tb and cut the yellow and green striped wire and put it on a toggle switch so when i go off road i can use it when i want IT'S AWESOME!!!!!
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Super_Dak
Dodge Dakota
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5/19/2008
20:15:16
| RE: Torque Management
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That's not really helpful, Steve. You didn't give the location of this yellow and green striped wire that you cut.
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wylman
Dodge Dakota
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5/25/2008
23:37:18
| RE: Torque Management
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Wow!! I just posted a question asking about this very thing!!
Super_Dak, it really depends on what year you have. I have a 00 as well. My Tranny Control Module is just behind the passenger side headlight and in front of the stock airbox snorkel. Pin 10 yellow/dark green wire. Snip and install the toggle.
Unfortunately, if you have an 02 ( I believe...) or newer. The PCM and TCM are all one unit and this nifty little mod cannot be performed!! That little wire sends a request to the PCM to reduce torque during WOT takoffs and WOT 1st to 2nd gear shifts. I am going to do this little mod prior to my next 200 ft dash through the mud at the track and see if it improves my E.T.!! Any responses to my post on anyone elses experiences with this mod will be greatly appreciated!!
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wylman
Dodge Dakota
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6/01/2008
16:50:41
| RE: Torque Management
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Message:
I cut the yellow and dark green wire from the TCM to the PCM for my race last night. It didn't do as much as I hoped it would but it did pick me up over a tenth of a second. It doesn't really do anything but make the shifts more noticable either. A pretty stupid idea the factory had there, if you ask me.
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