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Jason
Dodge Dakota
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5/14/2002
15:51:18

Subject: AMSOIL
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I have a 2002 3.9L dakota and was wondering which AMSOIL is the best to use? is the 0W-30 the best for my engine? and what do the numbers mean? thanks!



Prospector
Dodge Dakota
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5/14/2002
16:22:13

RE: AMSOIL
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I use the Amsoil 0w-30 in my 5.9 V-8, I found out
about Amsoil years ago at a trade show in Georgia.

The "0" in 0w-30 means that it has virtually no
resistance to flow and the "30" means that it
gives you the shear protection of a 30 wt. oil at
operating temperature (I picked up three m.p.g. in
fuel economy by switching to the 0w-30)

I also use the Amsoil SuperShift Racing
transmission fluid for a real firm shift in my
transmission and I also use the synthetic gear
lube in the differential.

Corvette Fever magazine recently featured the
Amsoil 0w-30 oil in some dyno testing (they
praised it!) and that made me feel a lot better
about using it.

I don't want this post to sound like an
advertisement but when a product really impresses
me I tend to toot my horn a little.

Hope some of this information helps you!



Jason
Dodge Dakota
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5/14/2002
17:28:22

RE: AMSOIL
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two questions

1) is the 0w-30 protect as good as a 10w-30? I want it to protect good too

2)I would also like to replace my differential gear lube, how do I go about doing that? is there a plug? where do I put the new lube in?



YJ
Dodge Dakota
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5/14/2002
17:38:26

RE: AMSOIL
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0w-30 doesn't protect as well as 5w or 10w-30 during inital startups. After your beast is warmed up, should be about the same. Use olive oil. It's super thin. ; )

YJ

Black 2K QC 4x4 4.7 3.92 KVT910DVD
Black 91 YJ 4LHO Borla | 5" Suspension Lift



sandman
Dodge Dakota
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5/14/2002
20:51:50

RE: AMSOIL
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If you stick with a major brand like: Amsoil, Mobile 1, Redline,Royal Purple or NEO I doubt you will see any real world difference! If you are looking for extended drain then go with Redline or Amsoil.



Jason
Dodge Dakota
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5/15/2002
02:41:54

RE: AMSOIL
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wont see any difference in what?



FYI
Dodge Dakota
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5/17/2002
06:57:44

RE: AMSOIL
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I believe that sandman was saying
that if you are going to change your oil
every 3000 or so miles that there is
"no difference" as to the leading synthetics
(Amsoil, Mobile 1, Redline,Royal Purple or NEO I)
as they will all provide you with protection,
but to go with either Amsoil or Redline if you
are looking to go "extended drain intervals" as
they are formulated for that purpose.



AmsoilSponsor
Dodge Dakota
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5/17/2002
11:14:12

RE: AMSOIL
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Jason,
Regarding Motor Oil Question: 0w-30 is race-proven technology designed for passenger car performance. Provides unsurpassed fuel efficiency and wear protection. Recommended for use in all vehicles requiring 5W-20, 5W-30 or 10W-30 motor oils.
---------------------------------
Regarding Gear lube:
Helpful Differential Recommendations:

Flush (drain) as much of the old fluid out.

Differential fluid capacity depends on ring gear and axle housing size.

Do not over/under fill differential. This could mean a capacity difference of a quart or more and may cause over heating problems. (See the owner’s manual for proper fill level)

AMSOIL gear oils are formulated with friction modifiers for limited slip differential applications. There is no need to add limited slip or additional additives.

After changing the differential fluid, drive the vehicle in 7 or 8 figure eight turns, so new lubricant can work its way into the axle assembly.
Provides the long-lasting protection, fuel efficiency and dependability needed for top performance, even in extreme-pressure conditions. Stays fluid in cold temperatures for easy cold-weather shifting.
----------------------
Amsoil Series 2000 Synthetic 75w-90 - Excellent for use in passenger cars and trucks requiring a GL-5 gear lube, including those with limited slip differentials. Racers and truckers use them, and they will work miracles in your manual transmission or differential.
-------------------




Jason
Dodge Dakota
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5/17/2002
11:24:29

RE: AMSOIL
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so I was wondering between a regular 10w-30 and a 0w-30, which one protects better?



mdandl
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5/17/2002
11:52:56

RE: AMSOIL
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0w30 flows better cold and protects same as 10w30

1997 Dakota Sport RC V6, Magenta, Dynomax Ultra Flow, K&N, APC Clear Corners, NR White Face Gauges, Mopar Boards, rails and Others to come
2000 Dakota Sport RC V6

Art
Dodge Dakota
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5/17/2002
13:12:23

RE: AMSOIL
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Last oil change I was using mobile1 5w-30 and this oil change I went to mobile1 10-30 and I see a slight increase in pressure on the guage when engine is hot,start up pressure came up just as fast so Im sticking with 10-30 now



sandman
Dodge Dakota
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5/17/2002
23:25:54

RE: AMSOIL
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If Ow30 is so hot then why does the viper come filled with 15w50? Have not seen a Vette yet leave the assemble line with 0w30 either! Every weight of oil has been "Race Proven". Jason everything is a trade off! THe thiner oils can cool off rings much faster "if" they do not boil off because they can disapate heat faster. A thiner oil can not cushion parts or form a hydralic barrier as well as thicker oils do. Think of it like this if I made you jump out of a window on the third floor of a house would you rather land on 0 inches of synthetic foam or 10 inchs of synthetic foam. Under ideal conditions no metal parts should ever touch so a thin oil should work well but in the real world metal parts do try to touch. Amsoil would have you belive that the 4 ball wear test and Novak volitility test are the only measure of an oil and they are not!!! I like Amsoils products but the marketing hype on this site is not very well ballanced!!! He might as well just load all of the Amsoil marketing hype into a seperate forum. His posts are word for word from Amsoils advertiseing brochures! I know I have them all here at home. Remember he is trying to sell his product! High temp high load shearing at the bearings is also an important measure.



AmsoilSponsor
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5/18/2002
12:19:55

RE: AMSOIL
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First, my apologies to Sandman and everyone else if I sound like a walking commercial. Some of my posts are direct from the brochure (informative) and some are my own (helpful).

I was born in the SouthEast and now live in NYC. I graduated University and now work as an Investment Banker (Public Finance - Schools, Roads, Bridges, etc., and Venture Capital). My day job requires NETWORKING (who you know and what you know). Sandman appears to me to be very knowledgable and I'm sure he asks his clients to refer their friends (a.k.a. multilevel marketing).
So there is nothing wrong with either one ... we all do it.

As for being an Amsoil Dealer ... It is a great product, it is one of my hobbies, and I do it part time on the weekends. I don't like all of Amsoils sales pitches ... but I don't like all of the commercials I see on TV everyday either.

I don't own stock in Mobil, Redline, Castrol or any of the other oil companies so I don't promote their products to make the stockholders wealthier.
I offer Amsoil which puts money directly in my pocket, and into the pockets of Dealers I have introduced to the Amsoil opportunity ... yes Sandman I am trying to sell Amsoil ... as it provides me with a nice second income.

Regarding 0W-30, I again agree with Sandman ... I prefer to land on 10 inches of synthetic foam when jumping from a 3rd story window and use 10W-30 in my truck.

In closing - Mobil and Amsoil are synthetic chemical based oils. The true synthetics are pure with no impurities in the oil where petroleums will have sometimes as much as 30% impurities in its oil. True synthetics have higher ranges of temperature that they can handle than petroleum and give better performance. The choice is yours as to whether you use 0W-30 or something else.

Thank you for your time today.

Steven



Jason
Dodge Dakota
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5/18/2002
12:49:54

RE: AMSOIL
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so basically, the 10w-30 will protect better than the 0w-30?



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5/18/2002
14:19:01

RE: AMSOIL
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FOUR BALL WEAR TEST COMPARISON
(as Sandman stated earlier FOUR BALL WEAR TEST COMPARISON does not tell the whole story, and I will continue to update you with additional information, but I believe that your concern is the "0" in 0W-30 and how can there be sufficient protection with "0")

AMSOIL published a Four Ball Wear Test on its Series 2000 0W-30 motor oil. I wanted you to see just how well this new oil performed against AMSOIL and other major synthetic brands when it came to actual engine wear protection - since technical specifications do not always tell the whole story. AMSOIL scored very well again.

The test was run at 40 kg pressure @ 150 degrees C and 1800 rpm for one hour. The smaller the wear scar, the better the engine protection. Here are the results (all synthetic oils):

AMSOIL Series 2000 0W-30 ..................... 0.373 mm
Pennzoil 5W-30 ............................... 0.540 mm
Castrol Syntec 5W-50 ......................... 0.576 mm
Mobil-1 Tri-Synthetic 5W-30 .................. 0.589 mm
Quaker State 4x4 10W-30 (Synthetic Blend) .... 0.595 mm
Mobil-1 Tri-Synthetic 0W-30 .................. 0.607 mm

I think that the answer we seek is "Does 10W-30 offer "better protection" than 0W-30 , and I don't think that I have an answer as to "better". I will research 0W-30 further and get back with you.





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5/18/2002
14:48:51

RE: AMSOIL
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Beyond FOUR BALL WEAR TEST COMPARISON - you should compare:
EFFICIENCY, POWER, LOW TEMPERATURE PROTECTION, HIGH TEMPERATURE PROTECTION, VOLATILITY, SHEAR STABILITY, SERVICE LIFE, etc.

(Information derived from Amsoil Brochure. If you want to compare oils, you might choose to use 0W-30 and do your own independent oil analysis. I am sure everyone that posts here would like to see your results.)
--------------------------------------------------
Light-truck engines today are built for fuel efficiency and power. AMSOIL Series 2000 Synthetic 0W-30 Motor Oil optimizes efficiency and power without the sacrifice in wear protection that comes with many fuel-efficient, low-viscosity oils. Our Synthetic 0W-30 Motor Oil efficiently transfers energy from the engine to the drivetrain. Its low friction inhibits the energy loss common to high viscosity oils. Synthetic 0W-30 Motor Oil protects in high temperatures better than high-viscosity conventional and synthetic oils. Even after extended service in the engine, Series 2000 Synthetic 0W-30 Motor Oil maintains its ability to protect in high temperatures. Amsoil Synthetic 0W-30 Motor Oil is also specially formulated for superior cold temperature engine protection. It retains excellent fluidity in extremely low temperatures, so it flows quickly and reliably to allow easy starting and immediate lubricating protection. Our Synthetic 0W-30 Motor Oil is highly resistant to volatility. For example, in heat that causes conventional motor oils to lose as much as 25 percent of their mass, AMSOIL Series 2000 Synthetic 0W-30 Motor Oil loses less than ten percent.AMSOIL Series 2000 Synthetic 0W-30 Motor Oil's resistance to volatility keeps oil consumption extremely low and, more importantly, keeps the engine thoroughly lubricated and protected. Its resistance to volatility also helps keep fuel efficiency high and emissions low. AMSOIL Series 2000 Synthetic 0W-30 Motor Oil remains free of sludge, varnish and other by-products of high temperature degradation. With no deposits to foul them, engines stay cleaner longer for top performance and efficiency and maximum service life. AMOIL Series 2000 Synthetic 0W-30 Motor Oil is highly shear-resistant. With our excellent viscosity retention, the protection that goes into the engine is the protection that stays in the engine.
--------------------------------------------------

Thank You,

www.american-synthetic-oil.com
sroark@american-synthetic-oil.com



AmsoilSponsor
Dodge Dakota
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5/18/2002
15:49:19

RE: AMSOIL
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What Viscosity Should You Use?
In most cases you can simply use the manufacturers' recommended viscosity grade. However, AMSOIL Series 2000 0w-30 has been designed specifically to be used for applications which recommend 5w-30 or 10w-30 viscosity grades. If you looked at the technical specs for each oil you would notice that the 0w-30 synthetic oil has a very high viscosity index which indicates that it will maintain its viscosity through a wide range of temperatures and extreme conditions.

Also, its operating temperature range is quite broad. If you were able to take a look at our comparison chart you would see that this range is broader than the 5W-30 or 10w-30 of most other brands of oil.

In addition, the extremely high quality synthetic basestocks and long life additives which are used in our Series 2000 oils ensure that they will maintain their high performance qualities over thousands of trouble-free miles (35,000 miles extended drain option with the 0W-30, as opposed to 25,000 miles extended drain option with our 5W-30 and 10w-30 motor oils).

Still, I am looking for the "Holy Grail" of answers to your direct question of "which is better". Perhaps the answer is in driving style, driving conditions, geographic location (temperature extremes), etc.
--------------------------------------------------
Thank You,

www.american-synthetic-oil.com
sroark@american-synthetic-oil.com





sandman
Dodge Dakota
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5/18/2002
18:57:53

RE: AMSOIL
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I want to say that I do not have a problem with Amsoils products. I think they make an excellent product. I just think that their marketing is a bit strong and overpowering. They have a good site with alot of good information. I just do not want young people to think that they are the only game in town. I used to belive most of their hype until they tried to pass off a universal transmission fluid and then a diff fluid good for the life of the vechile. I have one vechile that I have owned 16 years. I could never leave gear lube in my truck for 16 years!!!!!!!



Jason
Dodge Dakota
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5/19/2002
00:05:45

RE: AMSOIL
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I live in Hawaii, where the temp ranges from 65-97 F, I should probably use the 10w-30 then right? cause the 0w would be used for cold temperatures?



Dr.D
Dodge Dakota
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5/19/2002
22:08:38

RE: AMSOIL
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I am running the 0w-30 in all of my vehicles and a
couple of pieces of commercial lawn equipment.

I am running a SCAG TURF TIGER with a 25
horsepower KOHLER COMMAND and I am using 0w-30 ?

It not only dropped my oil temp by 10 degrees
(according to my VDO oil temp gauge) it also
reduced my fuel consumption by 0ver 1/4 gallon per
hour (1.6 GPH v/s 1.25 GPH) and I have not changed
anything other than filters for over 350 hrs.
(I am running the AMSOIL ultra fine oil filtration
system and doing oil analysis evry 100 hours.)

And all of this equipment is used in the HOT
south.


Dr. D

P.S.

whichever way you go you won't go wrong with
AMSOIL.



AmsoilSponsor
Dodge Dakota
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5/20/2002
06:36:35

RE: AMSOIL
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Message:

Jason,
I believe that you have developed your own
rational conclusion. Yes, if I were you I
would use 10W-30 in the warmer climate of
Hawaii. Use whatever brand you choose, just
make sure it is 100% TRUE Synthetic. I hope
that I was able to help and let me know if I
can do anything for you.

Steven

www.american-synthetic-oil.com
sroark@american-synthetic-oil.com



Sean
Dodge Dakota
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5/20/2002
08:58:56

RE: AMSOIL
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weird, just checked asmoil site, and the regualr 10w-30 says to change oil at 25,000 mile, but the EXTENDED 10w-30 says to change at 7500? just thought that extended would mean longer than normal, in this case longer than 25000?



AmsoilSponsor
Dodge Dakota
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5/20/2002
09:33:03

RE: AMSOIL
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Amsoil has two 10W-30 Motor Oils:
(Information taken from Amsoil Brochure)
------------------------------
Synthetic XL-7500 Motor Oil

AMSOIL Synthetic XL-7500 10W-30 motor oils are specially formulated to deliver 7500 miles or six months of service between oil changes. Motorists driving 15,000 miles a year need only change their oil twice annually.
------------------------------
SAE 10W-30 SYNTHETIC MOTOR OIL

Due to its superior synthetic composition and advanced performance additives, AMSOIL 10W-30 performs much longer than do conventional petroleum and other synthetic motor oils, and Amsoils extended 25,000-mile or one-year drain interval recommendation.
------------------------------
Thank You,

Steven

www.american-synthetic-oil.com
sroark@american-synthetic-oil.com





handi2
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5/20/2002
10:08:18

RE: AMSOIL
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Why does Amsoil say 25,000 miles OR one year. It would take me aproximately 20 years to drive 25,000 miles. I would not leave any oil in that long because of moisture and contaminants. Any comments..?

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5/20/2002
16:07:41

RE: AMSOIL
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Why does Amsoil say 25,000 miles OR one year? For the very reasons you stated and some others. In my opinion a motorist should not leave any oil in longer than a year because of concerns of Viscosity Retention, Contaminant Control (debris that comes in through the air intake, metal shavings from the inside of your engine, combustion by-products), and Acid Control.

(There are instances where motorists have traveled 10's of thousands of miles with no oil change and if you would like testimonials I can provide them).

Combustion by-products will generally raise the acidity of your oil, which causes corrosion in your engine, and they will be left behind as the engine oil burns off and will collect on the inside of your engine as deposits. To maintain the viability of your oil as well as protection of the engine, the contaminants have to be removed and/or neutralized.
--------------------------------------------------
Again, due to its superior synthetic composition and advanced performance additives, AMSOIL 10W-30 is formulated to perform much longer than conventional petroleum and other synthetic motor oils (please refer to above description).
--------------------------------------------------
I'm sure that you know that ALL oil breaks down. (The reason for ... OR 1 Year). That generally will include basestocks and additives. Without focusing on performance characteristics, the most significant difference from one oil to another is how quickly breakdown occurs. Although there are many factors that contribute to the breakdown of an oil, heat is one of the most important.

Petroleum oil begins to break-down almost immediately. A high quality synthetic, on the other hand, can last for many thousands of miles (or one year) without any significant reduction in performance or protection characteristics.

Believe it or not (like Ripley's), Synthetics designed from the right combination of basestocks and additives can last indefinitely with the right filtration system.(see TRIGARD below)
--------------------------------------------------
TRIGARD Engine Protection Plan (company brochure)

Now you can virtually eliminate oil changes...

You can keep your oil clean and leave it in the crankcase indefinitely. From the company that pioneered long drain synthetic motor oils comes another significant breakthrough...an oil, filtration, and oil monitoring system that can virtually eliminate the need for changing oil in personal vehicles with mechanically sound engines!†

How does it work? Simple! You start with the best long life motor oil in the industry, AMSOIL Synthetic Motor Oil* and install two revolutionary filters, an AMSOIL Foam Air Filter and the AMSOIL Spin-On By-Pass Oil Filter. Together they are designed to keep the oil free of dirt and other harmful contaminants. Then, as part of your regular engine maintenance, you monitor the condition of your motor oil through simple, periodic oil analysis. Nothing could be easier!

You receive all the benefits of a super premium synthetic motor oil, plus you enjoy trouble-free driving for as long as you own your vehicle, usually without ever having to change oil again.

The system is called TRIGARD, and for motorists who have experienced the mess and expense of having to change motor oil at regular intervals, it may sound too good to be true. In fact, TRIGARD has been recognized by automotive experts as the motor oil lubrication system of tomorrow, which, thanks to AMSOIL, can be yours today!

†Although heavy-duty, industrial, commercial, and fleet applications are not qualified under this program, their drain intervals may be significantly extended with AMSOIL Lubricants, Filters and used oil analysis.

*Use any AMSOIL Synthetic Motor Oil. Semi-synthetic or petroleum oils are not covered under this program.
--------------------------------------------------
The major difference synthetics perform longer than petroleum oil is heat tolerance. Flash point is the temperature at which an oil gives off vapors that can be ignited with a flame held over the oil. The lower the flash point the greater tendency for the oil to suffer vaporization loss at high temperatures and to burn off on hot cylinder walls and pistons. The flash point can be an indicator of the quality of the base stock used. The higher the flash point the better. 400 degrees F is the minimum to prevent possible high consumption.

Today’s engines are expected to put out more power from a smaller size and with less oil than engines of the past. Therefore, the engines run much hotter than they used to. That puts an increased burden on the oil.

Even the best petroleum oils will have flash points only as high as 375 and 420 degrees F. For today’s hot running engines, this may not be nearly enough protection. Just about any synthetic you come across will have a flash point over 430 degrees. High quality synthetics can have flash points over 450 degrees (Every AMSOIL synthetic oil has a flash point of over 450 degrees F with some exceeding 475 degrees). As a result, you will see little noticeable breakdown due to burn-off.

Just as important is the way in which petroleum and synthetic oils burn off. As a refined product, petroleum oils molecules are of varying sizes. Thus, as a petroleum oil heats up, the smaller molecules begin to burn off. Since the ash content in most petroleum oils is very high, deposits and sludge are left behind to coat the inside of your engine. In addition, as smaller particles burn off, the larger, heavier molecules are all that is left to protect the engine. Unfortunately, these larger particles do not flow nearly as well and tend to blanket the components of your engine which only exacerbates the heat problem.

Synthetic oils, because they are not purified, but rather designed specifically from the ground up for lubrication purposes, are comprised of molecules of uniform size and shape. Therefore, even if a synthetic oil does burn a little, the remaining oil has the same chemical characteristics that it had before the burn off.

There are no smaller molecules to burn-off and no heavier molecules to leave behind. Moreover, many synthetics, have very low ash content. As a result, if oil burn-off does occur, there is little or no ash left behind to leave sludge and deposits on engine surfaces. Obviously, this leads to a cleaner burning, more fuel efficient engine.

It is true that the additives in many oils begin breaking down after only a few thousand miles. What needs to be recognized is that there are different quality “grades” of additives just as there are different quality grades of just about any other product that you buy. There are also different combinations of additives that tend to work for better and for longer when combined than when used individually.
--------------------------------------------------
Hope this was helpful.
--------------------------------------------------
Sorry to go on-and-on-and-on but I wanted to include as much as possible for anyone else that might read this post.

Thank you again for bearing with my long winded responses.

Steven

www.american-synthetic-oil.com
sroark@american-synthetic-oil.com





Sean
Dodge Dakota
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5/20/2002
16:30:56

RE: AMSOIL
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does anyone know about ROYAL PURPLE? are they 100% synthetic? is it better than AMSOIL?



AmsoilSponsor
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5/20/2002
17:48:29

RE: AMSOIL
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Sean,
I don't believe that anyone here can ever say that I have touted Amsoil as "the best". There are a few very good 100% True Synthetics that are available ... Amsoil being "one" of them. I believe different synthetics are better formulated for different driving types, styles, and conditions (therefore difficult to say who is "better"). Determine your own needs and go with what is best for you. There are quite a few "good guys" on this forum site that will offer you their assistance. I am certain that you and I would welcome comments from others. If I can help let me know.




98FlameRdDak
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5/20/2002
23:18:28

RE: AMSOIL
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Message:
Amsoil is damn good oil I used 10W30 in my V6 Dak and used 10W30 in my 95 Chevey Cavaliar.

I bought my Cavaliar new in December of 94. The first thing I did was change the oil. Went with Amsoil 10W30. I got rid of the car with 98,560 miles...so you figure every year I put atleast 20,000 miles on my car. Not once did I ever have an engine problem. And I will tell you what I did not have....every Chevy 2.2 engine starts to rattle at around 60 thousand miles. This is due to the automatic timing chain tensioner. My car never made this noise. I also changed my oil every 5000 miles instead of 7500 or 25,000.

I use Amsoil in my wifes Impalla, my lawn mower, my Quad Runner. Not once have I ever had a problem.

The only thing "BAD" about Amsoil is the cost...but I would rather spend the money now instead of later by protecting my engine.

I also use the filter that is made for Amsoil, for both the Dak and the Impalla.

So from past experiance...I am sticking with what I have always used...



AmsoilSponsor
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5/21/2002
10:07:04

RE: AMSOIL
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Message:
Jason,
Here is your answer:

" 0W- " is a viscosity GRADE, not a viscosity MEASUREMENT.
When testing for cold fluidity, the temperature is lowered
approximately 5 degrees centigrade between each test.

The Cold Crank Simulator Apparent Viscosity is tested at:

-20 C for 10W-
-25 C fpr 5W-
-30 C for 0W-

It is my understanding that the oil has to be labelled
at the lowest temperature it meets the specifications.
It may not be long before someone comes out with a " -5W-30 " which would correspond with -35 C.



CanaDak
Dodge Dakota
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5/22/2002
06:54:27

RE: AMSOIL
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Message:
I just ordered my first case of Amsoil 0W-30
since i live in a colder climate (Canada) and
0W-30 is what all my friends are using and it
seems like everyone is switching.



sandman
Dodge Dakota
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5/22/2002
23:03:23

RE: AMSOIL
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Message:
Just a litle tid-bit! My aunt's caviler went 300,000 miles with dino oil. All she did was get it changed at a quick oil change place every 3000 like clock work. She drove 90 miles per day on the HWY for work. It went through 6 starters but that was about it. It was stil running strong when she traded it in. So I would not be too concerned with getting someone to tell you whick synthetic is best!!! All true synthetics are better then conventional oil and conventional oil can protect well if it is changed before it breaks down. I am sure you will like the benifits of useing Amsoil in your truck. They make a good product. I just wish they would rein in their marketing a bit!!!!!!!!!!



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