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a real rebel
Dodge Dakota
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9/14/2004
21:23:16
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 Subject: RE: confederate stickers
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It's not hate it's history. Right?
Did it ever occur to you that you are displaying the flag of another country that attacked the US. If it's cool to fly the rebel flag then we should also fly the japaneese flag and the taliban flag...sounds cool to me lets celebrate a country that needlessly slaughtered americans...two thumbs up
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you idiot
Dodge Dakota
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9/15/2004
11:14:24
| RE: confederate stickers
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You got it backwards. The United States attacked the Confederate States. The CSA seceded from the US because of unfair economic treatment and those policies being reinforced in a lopsided Congress. Also, as regards 'needlessly slaughtering Americans,' I'll refer you to a history of General Sherman. He rode his army throughout the CSA, specifically destroying infrastructures such as railroad tracks and burning farmlands, homesteads and cities. Does that sound very civilized? Furthermore, Lincoln assumed dictatorial powers in the office of the President. He delayed a mandatory meeting of Congress once war was declared for several months, in direct defiance of the Constitution. He shut down over a hundred newspapers that printed articles containing unfavorable comments about the War. He placed orders for machines of war without the approval of Congress. Finally, it was him who sent the army to Ft. Sumter, forcing the development of the War. The US troops at Ft. Sumter had several days and every opportunity to leave, but Lincoln ordered them to stay because he knew this confrontation would either drive the Southern states to submit to the federal government's authority.. or else.
The inability of the CSA to defend their rights to secede saw the true birth of the current behemoth known as the Federal Government. It paved the way for wonderful, forward-thinking policies such as pushing Native Americans off their lands, claiming a mandatory federal income tax, withdrawing from the Kyoto Treaty, etc.
As regards "hate," the issue of slavery is not independent of the causes of the War of Northern Aggression, but it is not the central focus. Slaves were not hated; they were just part of the economic structure of the North AND South. Virtually all of the slaves imported into the US came through ports in New York and Massachusetts, from which they were sold to plantation owners in southern states. The Northern states had set themselves up in a nice little position wherein the textile productions of the South supported their industries and their denser populations. When the South finally decided they'd had enough, the North was faced with two choices: watch their own machinations fall into ruins, or declare war.
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99bludak
Dodge Dakota
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9/15/2004
12:18:51
| RE: confederate stickers
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"sounds cool to me lets celebrate a country that needlessly slaughtered americans"
Wow...
That means that no one should fly the American flag then huh? Afterall it was the American government that drove my people from the Great Lakes to the barren Oklahoma Territory and allowed us to starve and freeze to death while offering us blankets intentionally tainted with the smallpox virus to keep warm. My people and many other tribes were slaughtered with lead while we tried to defend our homes with the only weapons we had. Interesting how that part of history gets ignored or forgotten. They make us out to be savages and murderers coming in the night to steal livestock and scalp the whiteman. Well, I would have done the same thing to the bastards who came riding through my village shooting women and children and burning everything that I owned. Sorry for the rant, but let's not talk about needless killing of Americans without talking about the needless massacre of the ORIGINAL Americans!
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Kyle
Dodge Dakota
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9/15/2004
15:07:32
|  RE: confederate stickers
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To ‘you idiot’. I could not have said it better myself, hats off to you.
To 'a real rebel', open up a history book and do some damn reading. During the war, the confederate army was fighting for their states, there families, and there home. Slavery didn’t even come into the picture until years after the war started. And another thing, many organizations such as the KKK and Neo Nazi's misuse the confederate flag to stand for racism and the dream of ‘an elite group/country’. General Robert E. Lee and General Stonewall Jackson would have spit on the KKK and Neo-Nazi groups of today. True southerners are more pissed than anyone to see this misuse of the confederate flag. When I see the confederate flag I think of our forefathers who were fighting for the protection of there home and their state. If you can't read (which wouldn't suprise me), rent the movie Gettysburg or Gods and Generals.
To ‘99bludak’. The trail of Tears and the way Americans treated the Native Americans is a terrible story and we as Americans are not proud of it. The best we can do is learn from the past and accept others for there differences, right?
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Solar Power
Dodge Dakota
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9/15/2004
15:16:41
| RE: confederate stickers
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The last 2 posts are right on. Also the confederacy was not a seperate country that attacked america. They never wanted to be a seperate country, just to protect rites and have their own government. Maybe some people need to go back to school and learn history. The real history not the crap that they teach you in books that say how the natives were savages and that the confederates were just slave owners who did not want to give them up.
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Rebel yell-ow
Dodge Dakota
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9/15/2004
16:49:54
| RE: confederate stickers
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"They never wanted to be a seperate country, just to protect rites and have their own government. Maybe some people need to go back to school and learn history"
Hello wouldn't that be a seperate country??? I think some people need to take a government class. By your logic Canada and the US are the same country
As for the US attacking the CSA who fired the first shot???
On April 10, 1861, Brig. Gen. Beauregard, of the CSA demanded the surrender of the Union garrison of Fort Sumter in Charleston Harbor. On April 12, Confederate batteries opened fire on the fort. On April 13, Major Anderson surrendered Fort Sumter, evacuating the garrison on the following day. The bombardment of Fort Sumter was the opening engagement of the American Civil War. As for General Shermans tactics It's war, it's not suposed to be civilized
Kyle, never in my post did I mention the KKK or slavery. Let it go, I know the south seceded because of supposed states rights...They still formed a government and attacked the US. No matter how much you want to defend the actions with reasons it doesn't change that
As for the Native Americans...It was the british that handed out the smallpox blankets...during the french indian war
Damn and you guys think I need to read a history book...Maybe y'all should stop tring to rewrite them
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Haligan9
Dodge Dakota
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9/15/2004
17:42:22
| RE: confederate stickers
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With all due respect to 99bludak and his people as misguided as rebel might be he is mostly right about the small pox. It is the british that is accused of that however there is no hstorical proof that the ever actually employed those tactics. There is documentation that shows they planned on doing it. Even if they had it probably wouldn't have worked. The variola virus doesn't do well in sunlight and open air. It is best spread by droplets that can enter the nasal passages. On top of that there was already a Small Pox epidemic in North America and Europe at that time so it's more likely Native Americans contracted it from contact with europeans in general not from germ warfare
I don't mean to insult you of minimize anything the US or any other country did to Native American, but your facts on S.P. are a little off, everyting else was right on
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me again
Dodge Dakota
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9/16/2004
15:38:28
| RE: confederate stickers
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True that the CSA fired on Ft. Sumter, marking the first engagement of the War of Northern Aggression. But you all need to review the facts. Read
http://www.civilwarhome.com/ftsumterevents.htm
The CSA seceded from the US, THEN Anderson redeployed his troops to Ft. Sumter. Lincoln didn't himself order Anderson to move to and reforce Ft. Sumter, but now that it was done, he saw Ft. Sumter as an ideal opportunity. Not only would it force a confrontation, but it would garner the Union some sympathy for their isolated, exhausted, starving soldiers.
That's a decent website for a very brief history of it, but you have to be able to stomach the revisionist propaganda of which it reeks. For example, describing the bravery of the fort's "gallant defenders." In fact, the Buchanan administration attempted a limp-wristed resupplying expedition in January. Maybe he knew that if he sent armed escorts, he'd be responsible for starting the War. Lincoln did exactly that in April. He let those men sit unsupplied in territory where they had no jurisdiction for four months until he finally thought a resupply mission was feasible.
http://www.multied.com/CivilWar/Sumter.html#
There seems to be a tradition in our culture to blame the start of a war on the first shot fired, the start of a fight on the first punch thrown. Is the 'first engagement' really the start of a war? I don't buy into such simplistic reasoning. It is never like, "oops, we fired a shot! Now I guess we have to fight a war." Those kinds of decisions are made on much larger scales in bigger timeframes.
The facts:
SC seceded Dec 1860.
Buchanan, and then Lincoln refused to evacuate federal troops from a federal fortress within territory where they were not wanted and where they had no jurisdiction. Surrender demanded of Anderson Jan 1861.
Lincoln sent an armed convoy down the coast to resupply the fortress April 1861.
The CS Army general refused to allow this and launched his bombardment of the fort based on the estimated arrival of this convoy.
Incidentally, the terms of surrender were very generous and provided Anderson with the chance to honor his men. No one was killed during the engagement except for some Union soldiers whose cannon detonated prematurely while sounding their 100 gun salute on the way out. Also, CSA soldiers offered assistance to put out the fires after the surrender.
Sherman was an animal. I don't care who you are or what you do: attacking civilians is completely amoral and without honor. You do it when you are desperate or when you don't care for life itself. And not Sherman nor any other Yank had any justification for being desperate. They invaded the CSA because they didn't want their factories, their plush city lifestyles and their westward expansion plans to fall apart. If the CSA had succeeded in defending its right to form an independent nation, the Union would simply have had to pay market value for supplies.
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I
Dodge Dakota
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9/16/2004
17:23:40
| RE: confederate stickers
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Blah, Blah, Blah,
The persons who start wars NEVER fight them. For some of you to be so arrogant in understanding the dynamics of a war that happened 150 years ago speaks volumes of our state/stake in the world today.
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ding dong
Dodge Dakota
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9/17/2004
08:18:28
| RE: confederate stickers
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You'd call every historian, every sociologist, every psychologist and every archaeologist arrogant by that rule. Basically you know I'm right and you have no counter-argument, so you're claiming that it is irrelevant. It's the adult's version of a child's refusal: a sharp, indignant "NO!" Followed by the mantra of a typical citizen in a narcissistic society: 'it's all your fault things are this way [and not mine].' Try to be more active, and less reactive. I think I'm done with this thread.
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Kyle
Dodge Dakota
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9/17/2004
08:43:47
|  RE: confederate stickers
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Let's all remember,
The guy just asked where he could get a bumper sticker from.
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Marla Orsburn
Dodge Dakota
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12/19/2006
13:07:48
| RE: confederate stickers
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I am looking for a sticker about 2inch by 2inch square its a confederate flag, on the top it says
EQUAL RIGHTS
ON THE BOTTOM
FOR SOUTHERN WHITES
I picked it up at a gun show in Arkansas a while ago, its fading and I can"t seem to find one any place on the net, I am looking for my Husband, any one with info or knows where I might find one would be great thanks Marla Orsburn
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