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| From | Message |
| Kris Gen II   1/03/2001 23:56:34 |
 Subject: Cold air induction VS. Open K&NIP: Logged Message: OK guys heres one I've been debating about for a long time. I have a 94 SLT with the 3.9. I removed the restricter plate infront of the air duct tube to allow colder air in. And then I stuck a 3" aluminum tlube in side the black, grooved air tube to speed up air flow. As you all know the generation II K&N was not available for my truck so I bought the old fashioned open air filter. And repalced the sealed air box. I can't really figure out which one works better. What do you all think? Cold air vs. Hot air Kris |
| Bernd GenIII 1/04/2001 00:16:40 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Cooler air is more dense which in-turn makes slightly more power. The QuickD system will fit the older Dak's since they use the same TB from '94 on up. You can purchase the air hat from a Gen-III Dak for about $100 from the dealer or (better/cheaper) try to find one at a junkyard for about $40-$50. Then, you can use the QuickD system. The other option is the Volante Air Systems kit but you'll have to fabricate a bracket to hold the tube and filter up. Bernd D. Ratsch 1997 Dodge Dakota SLT Supercharged w/Nitrous |
| Bernd GenIII 1/04/2001 00:44:13 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Oops..here's the URL for the Volant Kit (Truck Performance) http://www.truckperformance.com/display.image.php3?image=Durango_open_500.GIF Bernd D. Ratsch 1997 Dodge Dakota SLT Supercharged w/Nitrous |
| Kris Gen II 1/04/2001 16:26:41 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Bernd I appreciate your help but, I don't have the money to invest more into my intake right now. I was just curious which set up of mine will give me more power and more mpg's. I have the "old fashion" round open sided K&N VS. my home brew cold air induction with a K&N inside. The home brew is the 94's big round housing with the K&N inside, I put a straight pipe with a 90 degree angle turn inside of the air duct tube. And then I removed that restricter plate infront of the air duct tube to allow cold air in. I can't really decide which one really works better than the other. |
| Bernd GenIII 1/04/2001 16:35:02 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: As long as you can get the incoming air (into the TB) a little bit cooler, you'll make a little bit more power. With what you have, you may make a little bit more with the open/round setup. I've seen the '95 factory system and it's pretty restrictive. But again, if you can get it opened up a little bit with cooler air from the front (or fender)...you'll be fine. Bernd D. Ratsch 1997 Dodge Dakota SLT Supercharged w/Nitrous |
| Kris Gen II 1/04/2001 17:31:56 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Man, you must be on this thing 24/7! For the past few months I have been running the open air filter. Just after I got done writing this post I went out side in Wisconsin's 10 degree weather and changed everything back to my home brew set up. I know I should wait a few days before the computer finally relearns after I disconnected the battery. So I went out and drove it for awhile, nows the time when I can really feel a power difference because a have a couple sand bags in the back with one heavy cap, I HATE that cap! Well let's just say right now it really stinks, I'm tempted to put the open K&N back on! I thank you for your help Bernd, I look forward to talking to you again. Kris |
| Kris Gen II 1/04/2001 17:56:51 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Oh yeah, check out this guy's intake at www.Intense99dak.com, I just might do it myself some day. Kris |
| Bob Dakota Enthusiast 1/04/2001 18:19:36 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Bernd help me out here...I have all ways read and heard from motor heads, that you don't want HOT AIR going in the intake.All but the (Mopar parts) unit draw HOT AIR from under the hood.In my opinion people are trying to cash in on the HotRoding market.I know from the Mustang boys that they all use a shield to keep the fan turbolance from getting to the cone filter. Bob 2000 DakotaCC SLT Plus 4.7L 235hp 355 L-Slip Auto. |
| Bernd GenIII 1/04/2001 19:13:31 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: You are correct. The hot air from under the hood can, in some cases, cause a performance loss due to the heat. However, with hoods such as cowl-induction or cold-air induction...they help to bring the cold air into the filters. (Kind of an expensive way to do it though.) On the cold air kits (K&N Gen-II, Volant, Intense, and QuickD), they help out much more since they have the capability of isolating the intake system from hot air. (This is done by pulling the cooler air from either the front grill area or fender.) The only one that works properly by isolating the cone is the K&N (and the Mopar...same manufacturer...different sticker). I know about the Mustang people isolating the filter...we used to install the cold air kits that put the filter in the passenger-side fender for cooler air. (That was back in '89) Bernd D. Ratsch 1997 Dodge Dakota SLT Supercharged w/Nitrous |
| intense99dak Unregistered 1/05/2001 11:31:26 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Thanks for the plug, Kris ;-) I first went with a 10" open air filter before going to my current FIPK clone and the performance difference between the two is very noticeable. The open air filter looks better (IMHO), but during the summer months it wasn't worth the loss in performance. Chuck Robbins '99 Dakota Sport www.intense99dak.com |
| Daniel D Unregistered 1/05/2001 15:04:11 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: I am currently running a K&N open element 9". I do like the way it looks, but it does suck alot of hot air. That could be why wheni ran my truck in the summer, it was alot slower than in the cooler months. Even though i had a better exhast system. I am thinking about running a hose from behind the grill to the air cleaner to give it colder air. Anyone got any suggestions? I am also on a VERY tight budget. New tires get expensive. :-) |
| Kris Gen II 1/05/2001 16:34:04 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Hey Chuck, I've been going to your site a lot, you give me a lot of ideas for mods. Hey I was curious, I'm not familiar with the generation III radiators, but I don't remember seeing an overflow tank on yours. Because I want to install an electric fan and can't decide if I want to remove the fan shroud or not (I see that Bernd left his in). And I don't want to have to find a different overflow tank. Did the fan help out with power? Kris |
| Bernd GenIII 1/05/2001 22:47:01 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: I had originally left mine in but found that moving the electric fan to the middle and removing the shroud didn't cause any cooling problems...actually leave more space to work with. The fan is good for about 5-10HP max. But...the engine does spin up a just a little bit quicker and heats up just a little bit faster in the mornings. Bernd D. Ratsch 1997 Dodge Dakota SLT Supercharged w/Nitrous |
| intense99dak Unregistered 1/06/2001 09:11:23 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Kris, My overflow tank is in the stock position (on the driver's side of the radiator). I kept fan shroud off because I like the looks, but I am thinking about having a custom one made up which is shallower than the stock shroud. If I do have one made up, I will design it so the electric fan attaches to the new shroud and not with those rods that go through the radiator fins. I did notice an increase in performance (5-10 hp sounds right), but I also installed the ASP crank pulley at the same time so my gains were a bit more. Chuck Robbins still waiting on a password, Mark ;-) www.intense99dak.com |
| intense99dak Unregistered 1/06/2001 09:27:25 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Daniel D., Check out http://www.intense99dak.com/ramair.htm for some pictures of the setup I had before going to my FIPK clone. I used 4" dryer duct (not the aluminum foil spiral wire type)and plastic zip ties. The passenger side goes into the space beside the radiator. The driver side goes around the power steering pump to below the front bumper. Both locations caught enough air so i could see the results on the filter (dust), but I never had any problems with water. You can do both sides for under $20 and you will see an improvement (it is not true ram air though ... I agree with Bernd) Chuck robbins www.intense99dak.com |
| Bob Dakota Enthusiast 1/06/2001 13:01:03 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Hey gentlemen ck out the new Liberty air intake set up on the new 3.7L...It is trick,looks like it drowse from the grill. (Motor Trend February 2001) 2000 DakotaCC SLT Plus 4.7L 235hp 355 L-Slip Auto. |
| Bernd GenIII 1/06/2001 14:58:16 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: I was looking at two articles on it. Not bad...but only 40HP more than the 3.9L?? They could have done better than that. Personal opinion on the Liberty: It just doesn't look like a Jeep anymore. Looks too much like those Jap-SUV's. Bernd D. Ratsch 1997 Dodge Dakota SLT Supercharged w/Nitrous |
| Bob Dakota Enthusiast 1/06/2001 15:35:31 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Come on Bernd--the front looks VERY Jeep.I work there, I have to stick up for them.HeHe Once again I have to love the overhead cam 3.7L engine...It has less cu.ins than the 3.9L with way more more Horse Power,just like my little 287 cu.in Dakota.The potential is there! Bob 2000 DakotaCC SLT Plus 4.7L 235hp 355 L-Slip Auto. |
| Bernd GenIII 1/06/2001 15:49:59 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: But no more TQ than the 3.9L. Ok...so the grill is still "Jeep Looking"...but it's rearside looks like a RAV4 or Honda. (40HP...ooooohhhh....hold me back.) ;) Bernd D. Ratsch 1997 Dodge Dakota SLT Supercharged w/Nitrous |
| Kris Gen II 1/06/2001 16:51:49 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: I was told by a buddy of mine that Dodge's have a wire that heats the air up in the throttle body. What kind of temperature does the air/fuel mixture have to be in order for it to fully 'atomize'? I ask two teachers of mine about this. My auto teacher (who has a well known history in NASCAR transsmissions, MFR is his companies name) and my physics teacher(yes, I'm in high school). The auto teacher said that air ducting would be better for me while the physics teacher said (also a fan of 68 Camaros) that the open element (with hot air) would be better because the mixture fully atomizes in warm air where cold it doesn't mix very well. Oh yeah, I took a trip to the exhaust shop that did my glasspack with duals set-up. Because I have the V6 it's sounds like crap. I told them I wanted to stick in the Gibson/ single pipe set-up for better low end torque. They told me my set-up was better than any of the aftermarket set-ups and that gibsons wher crap, I don't belive them, any one with the V6 and the gibson please tell me about it. And my final paragraph of my novel for today: Since I'm going to keep my open round filter for now, ive decided to keep the factory fan also. With that Filter I'll need as much cfm's under the hood as I can get, and the factory fan is best at that. Not as much as it used to though, I installed ASP under drive pulleys a while back. while sitting at a stop light in the bitter cold my charge gets really low an electric fan would make it worse. gotta get back ot work,lunch break is almost over Kris |
| Bob Dakota Enthusiast 1/06/2001 20:35:17 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Kris anyone that sells a high performance part is going to tell you there,s is the best.But the proof is on a Dino test or look to see what the majority run. My opinion Bob 2000 DakotaCC SLT Plus 4.7L 235hp 355 L-Slip Auto. |
| Bernd GenIII 1/06/2001 20:39:46 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: I think what you're buddy was thinking about is the wire in a Mass Air Flow Meter. Dodge doesn't have anything like that on their Magnum (or Pre-Mag) engines. I ran into the same charging problem on my Dak (with the electric fan) but holding the pedal at about 1000-1100 fixes that over extended idling periods. Who oever said that Glasspacks are better than the Gibson is smoking crack. Bernd D. Ratsch 1997 Dodge Dakota SLT Supercharged w/Nitrous |
| Bob Dakota Enthusiast 1/06/2001 21:29:45 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Kris and Bernd... if you want to play you got to pay. If you want to dance you got to pay the fiddler.When ever I drive my Mustang,I have to keep the idle up to about a 1000 rpm...higher if I use the air.(under drive pulleys)but worth the aggravation. my 02$ Bob 2000 DakotaCC SLT Plus 4.7L 235hp 355 L-Slip Auto. |
| Daniel D Unregistered 1/07/2001 00:36:59 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: I had dual glasspacks on my 95 V6, it sounded "ok" i curently have a 2-chamber flowmaster dumped. i get mistaken for a V8 sometimes. alot better performance and sound. i would think that the electric fan would flow more air than a stock clutch fan. I would rather have the extra 5-10 hp than a little more air. i dunno though. |
| Kris Gen II 1/07/2001 01:29:37 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: A while ago I replaced the PCV valve on my truck. I've never heard a PCV valve be so loud before on my couple of years of working on cars. I know the PCV is suppose to make some noise, but not this loud! Of course the truck runs better with it in, could this noise be from a leaking pleneum gasket? I hope not! Do you guys think I'm actually losing power with the glasspack and duals? And of course I have the dreaded KNOCK, but my doesn't happen while the motor is running and cold. I bought the 3923's and haven't been able to put them in yet. But, since it only happens when the motor starts to warm I do think it is a spark knock. So far I've added an accell coil and Autolite 7.5 mm plug wires and that still didn't stop it. Or maybe it's a pushrod knocking, I gotta start saving for a new 4.7!!!! Trust me, I know the whole deal on Mustangs, my brother had a 5.0 with a list of mods (about $8,000 invested into the motor). The stang ran 12's being naturaly aspirated. He got sick of the bugs it had and sold it for $4,500! The guy who has it now put a supercharger on it and is pumping about 550HP to the rear wheels. That's not a good idea on a bored .030 over 302 block it can only really handle about 450 before it starts to blow holes on the sides of the cylinders. It has subframe connectors and a roll cage and the body is starting to get a permanent twist on it! Oh and it does 10's in the 1/4! Kris |
| Mark Forum Moderator 1/07/2001 01:36:04 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: WOW, thats insane Kris. -Mark Hryckiewicz 
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| Kris Gen II   1/07/2001 02:24:46 |  RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&NIP: Logged Message: I could be driving that monster right now, but my parents wouldn't let me because I was about 13 when he sold it, now I'm 18. After that came a Jeep Wrangler with a 6 -inch shackel lift and 33 inch mud terrains, an ATLAS II transfer case (those are the best transfer cases) and a whole bunch of other goods. Sold that for about $5,000. Now he has a 1999 Honda Prelude V-TECH. Lets see, cold air induction, high flow coffee can exhaust, 17-inch rims, 2 inch drop, a V-Tech controler that kicks the V-Tech down to 3500 rpm's rather than 6000 rpm's and a turbo getting preped to be put on with an intercooler. I need a V8 for one thing then a 5-speed and a supercharger with nitrous so I can say HA! you got beat by a Truck! Any one want to buy a 94 SLT V6 with 41,000 miles on it? Gotta get a 4.7! |
| Bernd GenIII 1/07/2001 12:10:42 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Yuppers...the stock 5.0 blocks were limited. If you wanted some serious HP out of them, you had to get the SVO blocks. We had a '90 Paxton huffed Mustang running 12's all day and getting 20+mpg...topped out at close to 165mph (had the FMS Speedo to be able to check that...broke the stock speedo a few times.) Ahhh...memories...ahem..anyways....back to the Dakoat's. ;) Bernd D. Ratsch 1997 Dodge Dakota SLT Supercharged w/Nitrous |
| Bernd GenIII 1/07/2001 12:11:57 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: On the glasspacks...most "Turbo Mufflers" will out flow them. Change them out to a 2.5" IN / Dual 2.25" OUT...you'll be very happy with that setup. Bernd D. Ratsch 1997 Dodge Dakota SLT Supercharged w/Nitrous |
| Kris Gen II 1/07/2001 18:22:34 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Bernd- Actually, I want to save up for the Gibson single side exit. I'm impressed with the torque numbers it shows. Truckperformance didn't have them for sale last night when I checked. I'm going to scrap my old duals, they custom made them at that exhaust shop. I knew they were lying to me when they told me my pipes were mandrel but I knew they weren't. And they told me (more lies) that turbo mufflers and vortechs would slow me down because they were meant for "V8 back pressure" I'm pissed! They also said that Gibsons had a lot of fitting problems, BULL! I want that V8 throaty sound with the torque of the single pipe. Would 3-inch be too big after the muffler? Kris |
| Bernd GenIII 1/08/2001 10:06:15 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Bahahahah...uhhhh...sure...they'll slow you down eh? NOT! One key thing to keep in mind though: Anything larger than 2.5" on the V6 exhaust system and you will loose bottom end power (comes back on top end though). If you want to run the 3" tips, go for it...I run them myself. Just don't run 3" pipes. I know of several who run the Gibson system on their V6's so don't believe that it doesn fit. Bernd D. Ratsch 1997 Dodge Dakota SLT Supercharged w/Nitrous |
| Bernd GenIII 1/08/2001 10:06:31 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Bahahahah...uhhhh...sure...they'll slow you down eh? NOT! One key thing to keep in mind though: Anything larger than 2.5" on the V6 exhaust system and you will loose bottom end power (comes back on top end though). If you want to run the 3" tips, go for it...I run them myself. Just don't run 3" pipes. I know of several who run the Gibson system on their V6's so don't believe that it doesn fit. Bernd D. Ratsch 1997 Dodge Dakota SLT Supercharged w/Nitrous |
| Kris Gen II 1/08/2001 16:52:24 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: Aren't the gibsons with the single side exit a 3-inch pipe after the muffler? Does a 3-inch single pipe give more low end power over a dual 2.25 set up? Which would help me out all through the RPM band? Kris |
| Bernd GenIII 1/08/2001 17:09:19 | RE: Cold air induction VS. Open K&N IP: Logged Message: You have a single 3" or dual 2.5". Either one does the same job. Personal preference on looks. Let me clarify one thing: The 3" pipe that I was referring to is for DUAL systems...not a single system. Bernd D. Ratsch 1997 Dodge Dakota SLT Supercharged w/Nitrous |
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