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Cotharyus
GenIII
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10/25/2002
07:11:09

Subject: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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Someone - probly CW - can you tell me what the torque specs are for all of the bolts on the heads - head bolts, exhaust manifold, intake, etc? It occurs to me these might be good numbers to have before I start pulling my engine down. I won't actually be starting that project until next weekend at the earliest because of some scheduling issues at the local dyno shop, but I'll try to keep everyone as updated as I can.

2001 QC 4x4, 4.7,5 spd, LSD, 255/70-15's, K&N Gen II Intake, Robert Shaw 180 Stat, Hanson Enterprise custom front bumper, Highflow cat
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dr0p0ff
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10/25/2002
14:10:13

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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I'm pretty sure its 90-100ft/lbs. I haven't done any head work, but I think I heard those numbers from someone else


Keep On Truckin!
Sgt G

BlackDak02
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10/25/2002
15:45:23

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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Specs from the '02 Shop Manual:

Camshaft-
Non-oiled sprocket bolt- 90 ft.lb.
Bearing cap bolts- 100 in. lb.

Timing chain cover bolts- 40 ft. lb.

Cylinder head bolts-
M11 bolts- 60 ft. lb.
M8 bolts- 19 ft. lb.

Valve cover bolts- 105 in. lb.

Exhaust manifold bolts- 18 ft. lb.

Exhaust manifold heat shield bolts- 72 in. lb.- then loosen 45 degrees.

Intake manifold bolts- 105 in. lb. (follow tightening sequence.)
Here's the tightening sequence-
Start with third bolt in from front pass side then directly across driver side, then 4th bolt back pass side, then driver side directly across, then 2nd bolt back pass side, then driver side directly across, then last(5th)bolt back pass side, then drivers side directly across, then front(1st) bolt pass side and lastly driver side directly across. Hope you can make sense out of this.

Thermostat housing bolts- 115 in. lb.

Hope this helps.


2002 Black CC SLT 4x4
4.7L 45RFE 3.55 LSRD

"Nothing is more fairly distributed than common sense: no one thinks he needs more of it than he already has."
-Descartes

Duner
Dodge Dakota
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10/25/2002
16:36:38

Conflicting info!
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Although the manual states 60 ft lbs in the table for head bolt torque - in another part of the manual it states to go to 35 ft lbs then add 90 degrees of additional rotation. That additional 90 degrees of rotation ends up yielding more like 100-110 ft lbs of torque in the end (just judging by feel). I'm guessing that just 60 ft lbs wouldn't be enough to crush the gasket and would result in a blown head gasket or two.



BlackDak02
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10/25/2002
21:59:53

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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Yeah, you're right, I wonder why they mislead you like that. I threw that up quick because I was busy, 60 did seem light, but I thought it might be because of aluminum heads.

Rechecked the manual; they say to torque in increments: (M11 bolts are numbered 1- 10, the smaller M8 bolts are numbered 11- 14 )

Step 1- M11 bolts- 15 ft. lb.

Step 2- M11 bolts- 35 ft. lb.
M8 bolts- 18 ft. lb.

Step 3- Tighten M11 bolts 90 degrees
M8 bolts- 22 ft. lb.

There's also a torque sequence to follow working from the middle of the head out to the sides in an even pattern alternating from one side to the other as below:

__________________14
____________________12

7___3___1___6___10__11

9___5___2___4___8___13

______Front>

They also say to replace the head bolts if there is evidence of stretching (put a straightedge against the threads to check for this). Dunno, I never reused head bolts always bought new, better to be safe than sorry, IMO.

Also stated is to lubricate the M11 bolt threads with engine oil before installation. They advise using Mopar lock & seal adhesive on the smaller M8 bolts prior to installation.

They also say not to use anything metal to clean off the heads because they could be damaged by hardened tools.

Sorry for misleading with the first post and hope this helps.


2002 Black CC SLT 4x4
4.7L 45RFE 3.55 LSRD

"Nothing is more fairly distributed than common sense: no one thinks he needs more of it than he already has."
-Descartes

Cotharyus
GenIII
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10/26/2002
07:19:46

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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Thanks for the replys. I've got the bolt sets and gasket sets in the shop waiting for the job, but I've been working on the gasket removal thing - how should one go about removing the old gaskets - would an arosol gasket remover do it?

2001 QC 4x4, 4.7,5 spd, LSD, 255/70-15's, K&N Gen II Intake, Robert Shaw 180 Stat, Hanson Enterprise custom front bumper, Highflow cat
Check out my Dak

BlackDak02
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10/26/2002
10:38:08

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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YW, I've never used it, but I guess that would be the way to go, just be careful with it. Don't let overspray get on any plastic parts because the solvents might degrade the plastic. They also said in the manual that you can use plastic or wood scrapers safely.


2002 Black CC SLT 4x4
4.7L 45RFE 3.55 LSRD

"Nothing is more fairly distributed than common sense: no one thinks he needs more of it than he already has."
-Descartes

Duner
Dodge Dakota
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10/26/2002
11:24:31

No gasket remover necessary
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There won't be much need for that gasket remover. The head gaskets come off clean with virtually no residue. Only the head gaskets and exhaust manifold gaskets will need replacing - the rest of them are O-ring type rubber gaskets that are reusable. I didn't replace my head bolts either time I pulled the heads and it's just fine. The bolts don't stretch - the gasket crushes. That's where that extra 90 degree turn comes in.



Cotharyus
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10/26/2002
15:18:57

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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Well, I've got the bolts anyhow, and the head and exhaust gaskets. I'll have to see how everything turns out when I get around to doing this. I'm having a terrible time getting into a dyno shop somewhere around Nashville.

Duner - didn't you do a mild port/polish on your heads? Do you have any HP gain geusses on that?

2001 QC 4x4, 4.7,5 spd, LSD, 255/70-15's, K&N Gen II Intake, Robert Shaw 180 Stat, Hanson Enterprise custom front bumper, Highflow cat
Check out my Dak

Duner
Dodge Dakota
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10/26/2002
16:05:45

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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I did some mild bowl work and polished the combustion chambers as well as cleaned up some of the runners. It was good for about 3 tenths of a second with my original stock heads in NA configuration. I'm guessing that it's about a 25-30 hp gain. Since then I swapped out those heads and added some HO heads and cams which I left completely stock. The heads/cams combo appears to have been good for about the same amount of power according to the timeslips. Now I wish I would have ported the HO heads!

There is a difference in how the power feels though. The ported stock heads with stock cams made most of their difference in the upper end of the rpm range. Now with the HO heads/cams there is more available torque yet it still rpms good. The power is spread across a broad rpm range. I guess I'll end up pulling these heads off and "massaging" them a little bit. I'm still looking for that 11-second timeslip from the 4.7. hehehe



Cotharyus
GenIII
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10/26/2002
21:49:04

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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Thats good to hear. This truck will probly never see a drag strip, but if it does, I'll post a time. I'm also at some point going to measure off a little strech of road I play with sometimes - from where you pull out of a side road onto a highway here to a bridge - not sure what the distance is, but you can see a good 3/4 mile in each direction - anyhow, right now the truck will turn 70 when the front wheels hit the bridge. We'll see what it does when I get done. I've also gotten scheduled in on a dyno for tomorrow at 2 pm - I'll let everyone know what a K&N, 180, and straight pipe cat does for a 4.7. I'll be doing another dyno run after the upgrades, but I can't really tell anyone about that until Jonas says OK. Thanks for the tips tricks and info.

(PS: I'm shooting to put something like 300hp on the ground NA with this engine - anyone care to make and wagers on whether or not it'll happen?)

2001 QC 4x4, 4.7,5 spd, LSD, 255/70-15's, K&N Gen II Intake, Robert Shaw 180 Stat, Hanson Enterprise custom front bumper, Highflow cat
Check out my Dak

tmbailey
Dodge Dakota
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11/25/2006
17:11:28

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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im rebuilding the engine to a 1988 dodge dakota and was trying to find all the torch specs that i need. my main concern is the head bolts. but if someone could help me it would be great.



tbillion
Dodge Dakota
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6/19/2009
04:34:40

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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Dude... Duner, I advise that before you put advice up in a BBS you research why it is done. "The bolts don't stretch - the gasket crushes. That's where that extra 90 degree turn comes in." Bolts do stretch, in fact they stretch to their yield and then shortly after they fail (break) yield is the point where the bolt can not only handle its maximum tinsel but also stretch with the head as the head heats and cools. 90% of head bolts produced in cars today are intended to be torques to yield also why they are called TTY bolts. you see you torque the bold and then you yield it ... the extra 90 degrees is what puts the bolt at that pivotal point. TTY bolts are non reusable in the sense that they will perform there job still but they will not be ass efficient and after a while of hot cold cycles they will snap, and then the last thing you will need to worry about is a blown head gasket, you will need a head.



YO
Dodge Dakota
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6/19/2009
11:38:14

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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Dude,,,tbillion
You're responding to Duner's post.
I suggest you research why it is you are responding to a post that is nearly 7 years old.



tbillion
Dodge Dakota
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6/22/2009
14:43:33

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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it really doesn't matter how old the post is, the information is here for people to read, and i bet there are still people who come here for useful information. BBS are timeless



Sam
Dodge Dakota
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7/02/2009
13:30:49

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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I agree w/ tbillion. Here I am thinking about changing out the head gasket on my '00 4.7L. I need all the info I can get. Thanks for the education, tbillion.

(I suspect my head gasket due to engine running hot. Thermostat, radiator cap, coolant flush & refill, hoses checked. Fan still has to come on at highway speeds. Gage shows 210 on the dash.)



Kowalski
GenIII
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7/02/2009
13:43:20

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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That's still about 40 degrees away from the red zone. I found tbillion's post rather vague - he says 90% of vehicles are using torque to yield head bolts; but doesn't say if the 4.7 is one of them. Duner explained that the extra 90 degree turn is for gasket crush, not bolt stretch. I'd want to know whether or not the bolts are tty before making conclusions.

Lead, follow, or get out of the way

J.G. Automoti
Dodge Dakota
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7/02/2009
18:23:22

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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tbillion is right, 90% of EVERY CAR, uses torque to yield bolts, it is for a couple of reasons, as dissimilar metals heat and cool they expand an contract, the bolts must be torqued to where they almost break to achieve these results and to get the type of stretch needed, no so much for "gasket crush" crushing a gasket would be a bad thing the gasket is supposed to make up the difference between the stretching and contracting of the metals, when you "crush it " it cant do its job, and to answer the specific question ALL LA engine blocks use grade 8 bolts that are tty from the factory. so when you do a gasket you need to replace them... also look here >>>

http://www.engineproblem.com.au/torque.htm

Great information.



Kowalski
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7/03/2009
07:03:38

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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What about the 4.7 motor being discussed here ?
Clarification would be apreciated.
But, it is not in the LA family of engine blocks; so that info is irrelevant...

Lead, follow, or get out of the way

J.G. Automoti
Dodge Dakota
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7/03/2009
15:46:10

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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the 4.7 motor is not in the LA family no but its block design is based on the LA series. to the comment about "But, it is not in the LA family of engine blocks; so that info is irrelevant..." the thread name is "Engine (head) bolt torque specs?" furthermore I was just confirming what another poster had said. My attention wasnt to the specific block, within the next few days Ill find my factory manual for that truck and I will let you all know, for sure what it is that you should do.

Have you ever done a head gasket on a 4.7? Tell me this what are your qualifications to lead? Do you have Chrysler dealership training? what does the dealership do when they do a head gasket?

Let me share with you for a minute, I worked for Chrysler for 15 years, branched out right before this collapse so that I could start my own business, and for the past 5 years have been working my own automotive mobile repair service.



Kowalski
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7/04/2009
09:04:06

RE: Engine (head) bolt torque specs?
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Relax - not questioning your experience here.
Simply whether or not the 4.7 uses tty head bolts. I'm aware of the thread title; but also the fact that this thread has been specifically about the 4.7. I'm sure many will feel that it would be more accurate to say the 4.7 is the replacement for the LA series, than to make the claim that it is based on the LA series. There are many major differences, including the overhead cam design, and aluminum heads. As for my credentials for asking the question, perhaps just a little better at logic and/or reading comprehension than you. You asked, so don't take it personally. When information presented is relevant and correct, it is more helpful.

Lead, follow, or get out of the way

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